Ryan Klee, Rootstock

[00:00:00] Sanjay Parekh: Welcome to the Side Hustle to Small Business podcast, powered by Hiscox. I'm your host, Sanjay Parekh. Throughout my career, I've had side hustles, some of which have turned into real businesses. But first and foremost, I'm a serial technology entrepreneur. In the creator space, we hear plenty of advice on how to hustle harder and why you can sleep when you're dead.

[00:00:21] On this show, we ask new questions in hopes of getting new answers. Questions like, how can small businesses work smarter? How do you achieve balance between work and family? How can we redefine success in our businesses so that we don't burn out after year three? Every week, I sit down with business founders at various stages of their side hustle to small business journey.

[00:00:42] These entrepreneurs are pushing the envelope while keeping their values. Keep listening for conversation, context, and camaraderie. Today's guest is Ryan Klee, the co-founder of Rootstock, a thought leadership consulting firm that helps organizations and brands scale their business. Ryan, welcome to the show.

[00:01:06] Ryan Klee: Thank you so much, Sanjay. It's great to be here.

[00:01:08] Sanjay Parekh: I'm excited to have you on because this is actually one of those things that I think everybody has a challenge with especially when they're starting out, but even as they scale. But before we get into kind of you starting a business and all of this stuff, tell us a little bit about you and your background and what got you to where you are today.

[00:01:24] Ryan Klee: Sure, sure. I'm a Florida boy. I was born in Tampa and grew up there for a while. I went to school at the University of Florida, go Gators. And then I came to Atlanta after graduating for a job.

[00:01:34] I got a job at a marketing agency in downtown Decatur and kind of fell into doing PR. And I was really good at it, and I enjoyed it. And that kind of led my career in a couple of different areas, really good directions. And one more agency after that, one sales stop and a big corporate sales environment, which was interesting.

[00:01:52] We can talk more about that, but eventually I wanted to do my own thing and I took the lead.

[00:01:57] Sanjay Parekh: Yeah. So was marketing, PR always the thing that you wanted to do?

[00:02:01] Ryan Klee: My journey is interesting. I was playing high school baseball and went to college for a couple of years to play baseball. And so, when people asked like, what's your degree?

[00:02:09] And I was like, baseball.

[00:02:12] Sanjay Parekh: What position were you playing?

[00:02:13] Ryan Klee: I was a pitcher and third baseman.

You know, there's not a lot of demand for a 5 10 180 pound third baseman or pitcher that doesn't throw 95 miles an hour. So those dreams of playing professional ball were quickly dashed.

[00:02:26] Sanjay Parekh: Yeah. What was your fastest speed in a pitch?

[00:02:29] Ryan Klee: I was like a two-seam pitcher, so I was in the mid to high 80s. I was more about movement than speed.

[00:02:33] Sanjay Parekh: Got it.

[00:02:33] Ryan Klee: At least that's what I told myself. And then I transferred to UF and finished out my degree, and I have a degree in telecommunications production. So, I do a behind the scenes radio, TV and all that.

[00:02:44] I wanted to get a piece of paper that said I graduated college.

[00:02:46] Sanjay Parekh: Right. Okay. So basically, accidentally got into marketing. So, first job I'm assuming taught you a lot.

[00:02:55] Ryan Klee: And then I learned a lot. I learned how to go get coffee, scrub toilets, and then build spreadsheets and do media reports and be a client.

[00:03:00] I was a marketing jack of all trades kind of person. At an integrated firm that did not have PR at the time, but clients wanted it. So, we kind of started doing it right. And press releases, faxing press releases out. And it was, just went really well. I was like, oh, it's all about relationships.

[00:03:18] Yeah. Pitching the right stories and knowing how to sell the right story to the right reporter. So, it was a lot of media relations more than anything. But I really enjoyed it. I got to do a lot of really cool stuff that kind of gave me the itch to further get into that world.

[00:03:30] Sanjay Parekh: Yeah. So, at what point did you decide you wanted to do your own thing?

[00:03:33] Ryan Klee: So I was at my last agency, it was up in Buford, Georgia and it was a heck of a drive from Decatur.

[00:03:40] Sanjay Parekh: Right. That's a 30-, 40-minute drive, hour, hour and a half home sometimes.

[00:03:45] Ryan Klee: So, a lot of time to think and just, you know, I was always a guy that questioned the Monday through Friday, nine to five thing.

[00:03:55] Like is this my life now? I just do this for 30 more years and then I retire? And it just never sat with me. And I was always, why do we do it this way? Why do I do it this way? I fought with all my agency owners about PTO. Why can't I do this? Why can't I use the day? It's just like, well, I just let me have my time.

[00:04:12] You've given me like, just things. And eventually I was just like, I wonder what it would look like if I did my own thing. So, I started doing a side thing. I started writing some blogs and just trying to use some skills. I had to just do something. And then that just kind of, the thought kept getting stronger.

[00:04:27] And I had a great mentor at my last agency that really helped me and encouraged me and talked me through some things and let me just like get some things out. Like, okay, why are you hung up on this? Why, what's scaring you here? Why wouldn't you do it? And so, I just threw a lot of that stuff. I think she got to the point where like, oh, I was just, I'm going to do it.

[00:04:43] Sanjay Parekh: Yeah. Is this the first time you've been an entrepreneur? Did you do anything entrepreneurial?

[00:04:47] Ryan Klee: I'm a very late blooming entrepreneur.

[00:04:49] Sanjay Parekh: Okay.

[00:04:50] Ryan Klee: My family was, go to high school, graduate, go to college, graduate, get a job, work until you retire and then die. And I was like, oh, okay. Wow. That sounds very unpleasant.

[00:05:01] So we put it like that.

[00:05:02] Ryan Klee: My parents are awesome, by the way. That was just how, like, my mom was a government employee, my dad and stepmom were teachers at a Catholic school and my stepdad was an air force and then a government employee. So, they had a certain way they approached the world and that's how it was.

[00:05:15] So I never had any entrepreneurial ambitions. That I knew of, I think it was kind of in there.

[00:05:20] Sanjay Parekh: Right.

[00:05:21] Ryan Klee: Smoldering. So, I was like, maybe I could do this.

[00:05:24] Sanjay Parekh: Yeah. How did that go over when you decided to, to quit your job and do this entrepreneurial thing? What did people in the family say about that?

[00:05:31] Ryan Klee: Everyone was very supportive. My mom was kind of like, I don't get it, but okay, like I love you and I support you. I was married at the time and my wife was very supportive as well. And she worked, you know, I was in a great spot where we didn't have kids. We just bought a house. I had a spouse that was working and making money, so I kind of had a couple of safety nets and I was like, if we do have kids and I haven't done this, I probably won't.

[00:05:55] So it was that perfect time in my life where like, if I don't do it now, I'm going to I don't think I ever will. And then I'll regret it. So, I made the jump one day and I put in my two weeks notice and I had a couple of clients already from the side hustle. And I'm like, it's not a ton of money, but it's enough to pay the bills.

[00:06:10] It's enough to keep me fed and all those things. And I'll just kind of grow from here. And that was my business plan.

[00:06:15] Sanjay Parekh: Yeah.

[00:06:15] Ryan Klee: I didn't have a lot buttoned up.

[00:06:16] Sanjay Parekh: Well, was there anything else that made you nervous? Money always makes founders nervous, but is there, was there anything else?

[00:06:22] Ryan Klee: I was terrified. And one thing I learned that I love sharing with people is, you know, there's the expression, you never know what's going to happen. And that's scary. That's real scary. Cause it's true. But I learned if you flip that on its head and turn into a positive, you never know what could happen. Who can you meet? Who can you partner with? Who can you collaborate with?

[00:06:43] Like what direction will your business go? Some people have a very clear idea and plan and like, this is what I'm going to do. I wasn't one of those people. It was a bit of fly-by-the-seat-of-your-pants. Like I got my LLC through LegalZoom. I was one of those. You know, I just wanted to get going.

[00:06:58] And so by flipping that statement on its head, you never know what could happen, it excited me. And that helped kind of give me the courage to be like, just do it. And what's the worst that happens?

[00:07:07] Sanjay Parekh: Yeah.

[00:07:07] Ryan Klee: Fail. You go get a job.

[00:07:09] Sanjay Parekh: Right. Right. Exactly. And, I think that same sentiment of you know, what could happen also applies when you're working for somebody else, like you're not really in control of what could happen as an entrepreneur.

[00:07:21] A lot of times you're not in control of what could happen. You've just got to do things and hopefully everything kind of connects.

[00:07:26] Ryan Klee: You're going to stress about work no matter what, whether it's your work or someone else's work. And so, I was like, I'd rather stress about my own work instead of stressing about their work and making them money.

[00:07:36] Why can't I just do it myself? And it's scary. It was really scary. And to this day, I'm now seven something years into this, I'm here, but it's still scary and just different ways.

[00:07:46] Sanjay Parekh: Yeah, yeah, exactly. Okay. So, when you started, you had a couple of clients that came from the side hustle business.

[00:07:54] So how did you start thinking about how to get more clients after that?

[00:07:59] Ryan Klee: No, great question. So, my first client, and again, I didn't have a plan. I wasn't a thought leadership consulting firm yet. I was just a mishmash of PR and comms and media relations and whatever you'll pay me for.

Cause I could do all of it. And then I started collaborating. I have a dear friend who became my co-founder at Rootstock, Tom Bell. He's a former journalist and he was the co-founder of the Decatur book festival. And once he left there, he started his own brand narrative firm called Chronicle.

[00:08:26] And I always was impressed by him doing his own thing. I'm a little bit jealous. So, every now and again, we'd grab coffee or lunch and just, I'd pick his brain, and he'd fork me in my things and blah, blah, blah. And so, once I went, so we started doing some work together, like some small projects, well, then we got a couple of bigger projects and all of a sudden, we're like, hey, this is kind of a thing.

[00:08:43] And so like, you never know what could happen. All of a sudden Chronicle and Rhino Media, which is my first company's name, we're doing work together and landing some fairly large clients that are, you know, paying us good money and we're doing really good work. And we still weren't even a thought leadership room yet.

[00:08:56] It was still like, let's just, we'll come in and you mark an income strategy and we'll write good content. And have great conversations and help you think deeply about stuff and all this. Well, it just kept getting better and better. And we're like, we should probably get this thing named because Rhino Media plus Chronicle doesn't really roll off the tongue.

[00:09:12] No one knows how to introduce us to anybody, even tell them what our elevator pitches, cause we didn't know. So, we formed Rootstock.

[00:09:18] Sanjay Parekh: Yeah. And where does the name come from?

[00:09:21] Ryan Klee: So, we had a list of like hundreds of names on a spreadsheet. We're like, what are we like, let's pick some stuff. We wanted something that was about strong foundational stuff.

[00:09:30] Tom and I are both nature lovers. We do adventure races together up in the mountains. So, we do mountain biking and hiking and canoeing and over like 10 hours. It's a lot of fun. Right. So, we love being in nature. And I also like wine, and Rootstock comes from the viticulture world where it's about grafting, like one grape onto another grape's vines.

[00:09:48] You can create a certain kind of grape or a very hearty grape or whatever. So, it's foundational. So, we'd love to be like, let's just, let's just go with that. We both like it. Let's pick a Rootstock. We did. We happen to have a branding client at the time, and they built our brand for us, which is why it's so dang beautiful.

[00:10:03] Sanjay Parekh: Oh, nice. Nice.

[00:10:04] Ryan Klee: And that's when we started being like, okay, what is Rootstock? And that's when we started getting into the thought leadership and really drilling down into that and what does that mean to us and how can we be the best at it.

[00:10:13] Sanjay Parekh: Yeah. So, yeah. So let's talk about that shift. So you went from kind of PR, marketing, whatever your pay is for, to specifically this. Why that shift and why does this matter to you?

[00:10:25] Ryan Klee: We started seeing it all over the place. It's kind of like the modern-day influencer, you know, but in the business world, right? And so, we wanted to control what that meant to us. And we were working with a lot of founder-led companies at the time.

[00:10:37] So it really fit that niche because just, by the way it works, the founder's vision will influence the company's vision and marketing and things like that. So, we saw a lot of connection there, right? So, if we can help these really smart people get what's up here, get it out of their head and codify and articulate it, we can use that to drive the brand narrative, all the content you want to create to go after your, the decision makers you're trying to get to.

[00:11:00] So we just try to be really intentional and strategic about, get into that. And so, when you get to the tactic, it's a lot of the same stuff people know about and are doing blogs, case studies, broadcasts, videos, writing a book, all those things, awards, speaking engagements. It's the way you set up and the strategy and approach you take to lean on somebody's best thinking, really home in on that and then share that with those expanded audiences you're trying to reach and doing it consistently.

[00:11:28] And so a lot of conversations, we ask a lot of questions, we listen a ton. And we try to get the best out of everyone. We're just not, you know, spray and pray kind of thing. Yeah, never jump to tactics right away. A lot of people want to like, we got to take a step back because it will benefit you greatly if you can just take some time here

[00:11:44] Sanjay Parekh: So, I think in your story, I think I’ve gotten — and we haven't actually touched on it — so I want to ask. It sounds like this was completely bootstrapped.

[00:11:51] There's no outside investment. You guys threw in money. How much did it take to get everything kind of rolling?

[00:11:58] Ryan Klee: We have been so fortunate to have incredible clients that liked us, trusted us, and were with us for years. And like a lot of small companies, that eventually runs out and you've got to get outside of your network to find more of that.

[00:12:11] So we spent several years getting great referrals from people just doing well. And so, we didn't have to get investment. We didn't have to get VC. We didn't have to ask anybody for anything. And so, once we realized that well was kind of drying up, we started really focusing on how do we talk about our business and how to sell.

[00:12:28] And that's something I enjoy doing. I'm the face of the business. I'm the new business person. I love building relationships. They call me the connector. It's my nickname in the business. So, we just, we're just going out there and finding more people.

[00:12:42] Sanjay Parekh: What did it take to start the business?

[00:12:44] Was there any cost? It wasn't hundreds of dollars.

[00:12:47] Ryan Klee: I mean, we filed a new LLC piece of paperwork that said Chronicle and Rhino Media, now Rootstock. And that was it. That was literally it. We were already doing the work. And we were doing well. We kept raising our prices a little bit to be in line with market pricing and things like that.

[00:13:02] Cause we, you know, as a young company, we were pricing low and right for agency world, right? Because we needed work. Then we slowly just inch that up a little bit with each new contract and get to a point where you're at market value. You realize also we're providing exceptional value so we need to be able to charge for that accordingly

[00:13:19] Sanjay Parekh: Yeah. So do you still have that same structure where you've got Rhino and Chronicle owning Rootstock?

[00:13:24] Ryan Klee: So, the last 18 months have been a whirlwind for Rootstock. Tom, my former co-founder, and I say former because he's no longer part of the company, had a family health crisis that just derailed his year last year. And he wants to go explore other things. You know how it is when people pass away in your life.

[00:13:41] He had two of them pass away within six days of each other. It was awful. It was an awful year. So, he understandably wanted to go a different direction. Then we had a very rough end of the year last year, and I'll be completely honest, you know, the entrepreneurial journey is a roller coaster, as you know, and we were riding high for so long and it was inevitable we would crash.

[00:13:59] Well, at the end of last year, we had two clients leave us fairly unexpectedly, and they were our two anchor clients. So, all of a sudden, it's the holidays and we're panicking a little bit. Our co-founder's gone. We just lost a couple big clients. What the heck are we gonna do, right? No one's selling around the holiday or buying stuff around the holiday. So yeah, we use that time to get ruthless about how we spoke about the agency. How we sold ourselves and we trained the cotton from the website.

[00:14:24] We got more direct. But here's what we do. Here's the value it provides and here's how we do it, right? And so really I have to remind myself of this because I'm very hard on myself, but we've only been actively selling since January of this year. I call it Rootstock 2.0 and it's just hustling. It's just getting out there and meeting people, having coffee, lunch, drinks, whatever, right?

[00:14:42] And finding more of the right people. And that just takes time, especially when you have a longer sales cycle, like we tend to do. So, it's been, we've been through a lot, but it's what a lot of entrepreneurs go through and you, you got to lean on people that you have around you, your family, your friends, your spouses. Like don't be afraid to ask for help and referrals.

[00:15:00] Sanjay Parekh: Yeah. How big is your team?

[00:15:03] Ryan Klee: We have, we're fully remote. There's three core players, myself, Tara McVoy, who is our editor and chief of staff. Tara's amazing. Like I cannot talk enough highly about her. She is an eight-time published author. She published with Simon and Schuster for about a decade. She's the former program director of the book festival, which is how I met her. So she directs all of our client content. So I mean you've got an eight time published author like dealing with all your content, right?

[00:15:31] And then we have our third person, our project coordinator, Lindsay, who kind of takes care of all the important admin and back-end stuff, right? So, we're the three core people but then as needed we have writers, designers, videographers, social media strategists, we bring in people as needed per project, so it's kind of a new agency model.

[00:15:47] You don't have to have 15 people on staff just to have them, you can pull in people as needed, which helps keep costs down and things like that too. And it's fun, I enjoy that part of it, building the team for a project.

[00:15:57] Sanjay Parekh: Yeah, yeah. So, you mentioned fully remote. How is that in terms of managing and kind of making sure everybody's on the same page?

[00:16:04] Ryan Klee: Communication. You know, we use Basecamp as our project software, which is all Tara. She came to Tara as a unicorn that is equally creative and equally pragmatic with like processes and systems and things like that. So, Tom and I were like, are you doing that thing? Which list is that? I have like a million sticky notes here.

[00:16:22] I don't know which one's which. Tara came in and just was like, no, no, no, no, no. We're going to like bring some order here. So, we use Basecamp a ton to communicate and I'm bad. Tara has had to really help me like communicate because it's essential. So, they know what I'm doing and vice versa.

[00:16:35] Live communication, you know, we have a team meeting on Monday mornings with Tara and Lindsay and myself. What's going on? Tara and I have a new business meeting during the week. And then just as-needed check-ins. So just it's just communication and then we all have memberships of Switchyards, so we'll go meet in there in person sometimes to go see each other.

[00:16:51] Sanjay Parekh: Okay. Oh, so they're local.

[00:16:55] Ryan Klee: She lives down the road here. Lindsay lives a little farther away. So, we don't see her as much.

[00:17:01] Sanjay Parekh: Okay

[00:17:03] Ryan Klee: But she is she's invaluable to us and she'll come to our retreats or gathering. She'll drive in from Lake Oconee but so we get some in-person time and we try to make that a priority if we haven't seen each other in a few weeks. Like, well, let's go get a drink and hang out in the chat, not at work.

[00:17:17] Sanjay Parekh: Yeah, that makes sense.

[00:17:18] Adam Walker: Support for this podcast comes from Hiscox, committed to helping small businesses protect their dreams since 1901. Quotes and information on customized insurance for specific risks are available at Hiscox.com. Hiscox, the business insurance experts.

[00:17:41] Sanjay Parekh: Let's talk about clients and kind of what you do for them. So, you know, you're in this thought leadership approach for them. Like what resonates, what doesn't resonate with, with clients like that? Like how do you talk about the thing that you do and, and how does it make sense to them?

[00:17:58] Ryan Klee: It's a great question and something we've worked hard to address because I realized we couldn't sell ourselves very quickly. And so we, to us a thought leader is someone that is obviously very smart, what they do. But there's a difference between a subject matter expert and a thought leader.

[00:18:14] This is my next blog I'm working on, so keep an eye for that. But a subject matter expert is, you know, they're so valuable to the company. They could be an accountant or an engineer. Someone that has this very specialized skill and they're, they crush it. But that's it. Then they go home at the end of the day and like, they stay to do their thing.

[00:18:31] Thought leaders take that, but then they go public, and they share it. And they want to, to us, we like to say they elevate their entire field. So how can my thinking and my ideas, how are they better than the current best practices? What trends are we seeing that I can impact that can impact my business?

[00:18:46] And then share that with people, with all the stakeholders in your field, in your industry. How can the way we do stuff that we want to do stuff? How does that make everyone better? How does it make our entire field better? Right. So that's the, how we define that. And then through conversations, through strategy, through all these things we do, we uncover that key thinking that then fuels.

[00:19:07] All the content, all the sales stuff, like all the case studies, whatever, your speaking engagements. So, we have a Venn diagram of our three key areas that our work informs. Strategy and story, conversations and content, and connections and clout. And the clout is a big one because that's where, okay, you've earned that clout.

[00:19:28] You can't just say, I'm a thought leader now. Come on everybody. Come follow me. You’ve got to earn that. And you do it through the strategy and the story you tell and the conversations you generate and then you have, and you nurture people. And the content you're putting out there for your decision makers for whomever it impacts all that stuff.

[00:19:46] And so that's kind of like in the middle of that Venn diagram is your thought leadership position, which we have offering where we help you figure that out as a workshop. We dive into things like what you know, what you believe, what your vision is, and then how do you articulate all of that?

[00:20:01] Sanjay Parekh: Right.

[00:20:02] Ryan Klee: So that's kind of where we start with most people.

[00:20:04] Sanjay Parekh: Yeah. That's interesting. So, you know, to me it feels like this would be a bit of a sales challenge because there's not a lot of people that wake up and be like, you know, today I need to make sure that I'm a thought leader and do that. So, like how do you work through that sales process?

[00:20:20] And I think that's a challenge for a lot of people that are trying to do new things. That people are not necessarily looking to find, right? Like a lot of things that we do as entrepreneurs are brand new and nobody is thinking like, you know, today I need to find somebody that does this because it's not even in their kind of thought process.

[00:20:39] So how do you deal with that for yourself?

[00:20:41] Ryan Klee: It's a challenge, to be honest, but when you find the people that get it, it's so amazing and very rewarding and it's so funny because some people get it right away. We've had, we have a current client that took us a year or probably a year and a half to sign.

[00:20:55] From the first moment he met us, he said, oh, I love your approach. I want to work with you. I'm just not in a position to do it yet. So that was a year and a half nurture to get us where we are and now, we're just having so much fun with this client. It's going to be a long-term thing. So, he got it.

[00:21:08] But folks that don't get it, that's where, okay, well, that's where we just get better at talking about it. Right? What are your goals? What do you want to do? What are you trying to do? And let's help. Let's just figure that out together. It's super-duper collaborative. It's how we operate.

[00:21:21] Like the clients that we don't do well with, and we've had some that didn't work out where they hire us and they're like, okay, great, I'm going away now, thought leader. It's like, that's, that's not how it works. We told you what we were going to do. That was just, that was just flamed out.

[00:21:35] It's not a great fit. And that's okay. But we've learned through that who are the great people we're going after and that would value our work because you're right. There's a lot of smart people out there and there's a lot of egotistical people out there. It's finding that balance of smart, a little bit of ego, but a good kind of ego, but not too much.

[00:21:50] And you won't listen and participate in the conversations to, again, help you and your company. All we're trying to do is get you, like elevate you in your field so that if client prospect X you're going after, and they're deciding between you and a competitor, well, hopefully you are above them with the way you think and the way you approach the work.

[00:22:08] And they're going to want to pick you and not this person. So it's not a direct lead tool. We're very much a top-of-funnel organization. But it does impact lead generation because if you're out there at an event and you speak and then 10 people want to come talk to you afterwards 'cause you've impacted them.

[00:22:23] That's huge. Or if you've done a podcast and you start getting emails about it or you're posting on LinkedIn. And someone's like, hey, I like that blog. Let's talk more.

[00:22:30] Sanjay Parekh: Yeah. So, let's kind of switch gears a little bit and talk about, you know, you've been doing this now for seven or so years.

[00:22:37] There's probably been a lot of things that have happened along the way that now you're like, okay, knowing now what I know, I would've done that differently. What's top of mind for you of like one of those things?

[00:22:50] Ryan Klee: Oh man, you know, I always want to say like, oh, I’d do nothing differently. You know, things happen for a reason.

[00:22:54] And I believe that to a certain extent. You know, for us, I wish I would have, I kind of made a mistake. I said, I'd never do when I was at my past agencies where either you're relying on like one really big, like key client, that's like fueling everything and you lose them. Like everyone's screwed.

[00:23:11] Or a bunch of big clients. If you lose one of them, you've got to fire people. And then also not make a mistake of doing no business development when times are good.

[00:23:20] Sanjay Parekh: Yeah.

[00:23:21] Ryan Klee: That's one thing we did that I wish I could do differently. We're cranking. Even though I was going through. Deals are just going to keep coming and it's fine.

[00:23:28] You know, but then your co-founder leaves you and then your two biggest clients leave you. And all of a sudden, you're in a lurch and you're kind of in panic mode. And then you're coming from a place of scarcity and not a place of abundance, which impacts the way you approach prospects.

[00:23:42] And you don't want to be, you don't want to seem desperate. You don't want to be like, you don't, you don't want to lower your prices to get more people in the door. So, if I could have done one thing differently, it would have been, really trimming the brand down more to what it is now, but like a year and a half.

[00:23:56] Sanjay Parekh: Yeah. When those two clients left those two big ones, how many days apart were they where they let you know that?

[00:24:02] Ryan Klee: Gosh, I remember the first call. It was a Friday and I was going to a winery in north Georgia with my girlfriend at the time, right? That was mid-November. Okay, and then probably three or four weeks later the other one. I drew and this is why this is when I look twice now when see Terrence’s name pop up my phone.

[00:24:20] Now she's like, I hope you're sitting down. I'm like, oh gosh, what's going on? It was one of those times of the year and we got through it and right through having an amazing team and the foundation of trust and respect that we come from. We can have tough conversations. But I wish we would have filled that pipeline earlier because right now our pipeline is fuller than it's ever been.

[00:24:41] I think we're facing a lot of issues. Other agencies and consulting firms are facing where people just are tightening the wallets a little bit. So, the pipeline is full, but we can't get people to pull the trigger. And I'm hearing that from a lot of different agency consulting owners.

[00:24:54] So that'd be one thing I wish we could have gone back and done differently, but we can't. So, we've been crushing it since we figured that out.

[00:25:00] Sanjay Parekh: Yeah. What's the shortest timeframe you've ever gone from somebody at the top of the funnel to signed and what's the longest from that? You mentioned one that was a year and a half.

[00:25:08] Is that the longest?

[00:25:10] Ryan Klee: That's our longest. Our shortest has been like a week.

[00:25:12] Sanjay Parekh: Oh, that's really good.

[00:25:13] Ryan Klee: More of those, right? Everybody does. And all of a sudden they're like, okay, great. Sounds good. I'm like, I thought we'd have like four more calls, right? Let's rock. So that's great. So, we've, we've seen the spectrum, but really that averages, you know, it's a few conversations.

[00:25:27] Like we're having a great talk right now with the prospect where we've had two talks. They've seen an initial very loose proposal. Now we're working on a more specific scope because we've got more intel from them. We'll present that and blah, blah, blah. So that'll be, assuming we get them, fingers crossed, you never want to assume that'll be a couple of months probably.

[00:25:44] So it could be anywhere from a week, which is rare, to a year and a half, which is rare. So usually, it's like a three-to-six-month kind of period. And some of these old clients we're talking to again about working together again just in a different capacity. We do good work and we are relationship people and we don't burn bridges unless there's a reason to, but we're not those kind of people.

[00:26:02] So that makes me happy too that maybe we'll get to work with them again. Because they grow, they're growing and changing on their end and you just stay in touch. You have conversations. I play soccer with one of the guys. I was texting with the software consulting owner the other day. We're just kind of just commiserating about stuff and it's not about selling and it's about being a human and just being like, yeah, you're a good person.

[00:26:22] I'm a good person. I can work. We're tackling challenges together. So let's just, eventually that'll become something…

[00:26:29] Sanjay Parekh: Right.

[00:26:29] Ryan Klee: Monetary and all that stuff, but we'll get there.

[00:26:31] Sanjay Parekh: Yeah. Okay Last, I think, question unless you say something that makes me think like oh, we've got one more. You've been doing this for a while, you know, you've gone through this first time being an entrepreneur lots of stuff in between. Any advice for somebody else that's thinking about doing the same kind of thing?

[00:26:54] Like you started with a side hustle and then went full, like either pieces of those, or both pieces of those. What's your advice for somebody else that's thinking about doing this?

[00:27:03] Ryan Klee: A couple of things. Don't be afraid to ask for help. People want to help. They just don't know how. So, talk to your colleagues, talk to your friends, talk to your family, talk to people in the industries you're maybe wanting to do whatever you're trying to do.

[00:27:15] Just talk to people because people do want to support you, and they want to help you. And that's one thing I learned. And it's hard to ask for help sometimes, right? I can do it all on my own, but you can't. And maybe you can, that's great, but you shouldn't anyway, get a team around you, build that support and ask.

[00:27:31] And the second thing is, and this is one thing I love telling people if you have your big goal and you want to get there or you're not going to get there in one fell swoop, right? Every day do one thing to get you to that big goal. Yeah, it could be a little thing, it could be a medium thing, it could be a big thing.

[00:27:48] It could be getting your LLC from Legal Zoom, you know, talking to your business lawyer about how do I get this going? It could be writing some website copy for your new website. It could be building your business plan. It could be writing a LinkedIn post about something like around your work.

[00:28:06] It's just, do a little thing, investigate this. Like how much will this cost? Like don't put it all off. Cause all those little smalls add up to the big, right? There's a great quote out there. And I forget who it is, but an old client used to use it. And it's like every big, it's just a collection of smalls.

[00:28:20] Sanjay Parekh: Yeah.

[00:28:21] Ryan Klee: Something. So just every day do one thing. To get you to that goal. Because if you wait and think, I'm going to have this grand day where everything falls into place, it's just not going to happen. And then you're unnecessarily stressing yourself out.

[00:28:34] Sanjay Parekh: Yeah. I like it. Ryan, this has been fantastic.

[00:28:37] Where can our listeners find and connect with you online?

[00:28:40] Ryan Klee: Absolutely. So, I'm on LinkedIn is my main thing. Ryan Klee. Our agency's website is Rootstock.agency. And I'm also on Instagram if people want to go there at Ryan O. Klee, R Y N O cause that's my nickname. But LinkedIn is my primary form of social media.

[00:28:56] It's funny cause I'm not a big social guy. Like I'm social in person, but I'm not social online. But I've got to walk the walk. I tell the clients to do all this stuff and how can I not do it? And it's a, it's a challenge. And the biggest challenge people face is consistency, and I face it all the time.

[00:29:12] So I know what my clients are going through. So anyway, you'll hopefully see more of me on LinkedIn. I can be as active as your buddy, Adam, who just cranks out all the content, which I love. So, LinkedIn website, you can email me, [email protected] as well.

[00:29:31] Sanjay Parekh: Awesome. Thanks so much for being on today.

[00:29:32] Ryan Klee: No, I appreciate you having me. It's been great.

[00:29:37] Sanjay Parekh: Thanks for listening to this week's episode of the Side Hustle to Small Business podcast, powered by Hiscox. To learn more about how Hiscox can help protect your small business through intelligent insurance solutions, visit Hiscox.com. And to hear more Side Hustle to Small Business stories, or share your own story, please visit Hiscox.com/side-hustle-to-small-business. I'm your host, Sanjay Parekh. You can find out more about me at my website, SanjayParekh.com.