Michelle Choairy, Wisdom4ComplexKids

[00:00:00] Sanjay Parekh: Welcome to the Side Hustle to Small Business podcast, powered by Hiscox. I'm your host, Sanjay Parekh. Throughout my career, I've had side hustles, some of which have turned into real businesses. But first and foremost, I'm a serial technology entrepreneur. In the creator space, we hear plenty of advice on how to hustle harder and why you can sleep when you're dead.

On this show, we ask new questions in hopes of getting new answers. Questions like, how can small businesses work smarter? How do you achieve balance between work and family? How can we redefine success in our businesses so that we don't burn out after year three? Every week, I sit down with business founders at various stages of their side hustle to small business journey.

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Today's guest is Michelle Choairy, the founder of Collective Wisdom4ComplexKids, a support group for mothers with children with disabilities. She founded this organization after her son was diagnosed with a disability. Michelle, welcome to the show.

[00:01:12] Michelle Choairy: Oh, thank you so much for having me. I'm so excited. I love these podcasts. So, thanks.

[00:01:18] Sanjay Parekh: Awesome. Well, I'm excited to have you on too because the area that you're working in doing this side hustle is such an important thing. And so many of us think about this because we have kids that have different needs. But before we start getting into all of that, give us a little bit about your background and what got you to where you are today.

[00:01:40] Michelle Choairy: Sure. So, I am originally from Brazil. I came when I was 17 years old. I've been here about 30 years, and I got married a little bit later in my life. And so, I had my son, whose name is Drake. He's 10 years old now. And, in the beginning, we didn't know what was going on. We knew that there was some delays during the process during, especially his first few years, and we started, I started that search trying to figure out what it was and about 2 years ago, he was diagnosed with a genetic disorder. It's called TBR1, and he is 1 out of 190 kids that have been diagnosed in the world right now.

So that, because of everything that I went through and what I have done for him, I want to help other moms and dads out there that are just starting this process to cut some corners from where I had to go through and actually teach them, hey, you don't have to do this. Just follow this right here, because it's going to get you somewhere, just giving them that support. So that's why I started Collective Wisdom4ComplexKids.

[00:03:07] Sanjay Parekh: Yeah, that's amazing. So, one out of 190 kids worldwide.

[00:03:12] Michelle Choairy: Yes.

[00:03:14] Sanjay Parekh: Obviously not a lot of resources because it's probably not well understood. So how did you deal with this or how are you dealing with this challenge?

[00:03:27] Michelle Choairy: Once we found out, once we had the diagnosis, really nothing changed in terms of therapies and things that we need to do, because there's no, really there are no resources for TBR1 when you look at it, just as that genetic disorder.

So, everything that we had been doing throughout, we started really the speech process and all of those things, when he was about three years old and that whole process. We got to this and said, TBR1, that diagnosis didn't change. And the interesting thing is that there is nothing out there. There's nothing. And so what we started doing is the moms with kids that have TBR1, we started supporting each other on a Facebook group. Just this past Sunday, we had the five kids that are in Southern California get together. So, it was great to see everyone and five out of 190, we got into one place, and it was great to interact and have that.

And without community support, when you have something like this, you can't do it, you cannot do it alone.

[00:04:51] Sanjay Parekh: Yeah. That's a very exclusive club you're a part of fortunately, or unfortunately. Fortunately, now that you've found others in it, unfortunately, that any of you have to be in it in the first place. Yeah, you got 2 percent of the club together there, in southern California. You've been dealing with this for a while. How long ago was it that you discovered that this is what the issue was and what was the catalyst for understanding that it was TBR1?

[00:05:26] Michelle Choairy: So, about two years ago, we went to a geneticist. I have been trying to get a genetic testing for a few years but my insurance company wouldn't agree to it and it's a very expensive testing, so we went in and they finally approved it. But here's the interesting thing is that, had I gone, had he done this testing maybe a year before, it would have come back negative because it was only a few years ago, two or three years ago, that this diagnosis was able to be found in a blood test, in genetic testing.

[00:06:14] Sanjay Parekh: Oh, wow.

[00:06:15] Michelle Choairy: So, anybody who has had genetic testing before two or three years ago, they were not tested for TBR1 because it didn't exist. They didn't have the test for it. They think, and they have an idea that they think that it's under diagnosed. And they might, we might have more people, that will start, we're going to start getting more of this diagnosis, but it was only two years ago.

[00:06:47] Sanjay Parekh: Wow. So, in some respect, not to give the insurance companies the benefit for this really, but it's good. They denied it for so long because, you would have had this well, I don't know what it is then still. And you probably wouldn't have fought to redo the genetic testing.

[00:07:04] Michelle Choairy: Yes.

[00:07:04] Sanjay Parekh: Versus now, it is being caught.

[00:07:07] Michelle Choairy: Yes, so, thanks, insurance company.

[00:07:11] Sanjay Parekh: Yeah, so I mean I'm not trying to give them the benefit here, I'm trying to find the silver lining a little bit maybe for you that the delay was maybe a good thing. So, once you figured out this diagnosis, what was your immediate reaction to this?

What was the next step for you?

[00:07:29] Michelle Choairy: So, once we figured this out, to be honest, nothing changed in terms of therapy. We were already doing what we needed to do for him. Because the only thing you can do is address his shortcomings. And he has a speech disorder. He has a behavior problem.

And so, you have to go in and you have to do, you still take care of it the way that you do. The one thing that I did do was join this group, this TBR1 group, and we got more of a community around us that we bounce ideas off of each other. And, the other thing was that once when a child in the state of California, where I live, if a child has a genetic disorder like this, they are, automatically, we have state funded resources, so that is really good because, if anything were to happen to me, once I got him in, if anything were to happen to me or to my husband, he would be taken care of because we're able to get him under that resource from the state. So that was really the only difference in anything that we've been doing.

[00:08:55] Sanjay Parekh: So you then go through this process, when was it that you decided, "oh, this is awful, having to figure out all the things. Let me figure out a way to help others." What was that spark that caused you to go down that path?

[00:09:15] Michelle Choairy: So I've been doing my day job for 17 years.

I do orthopedic sales for a big orthopedic company, and I wanted to do something different. I wanted to get, just wanted something different for my life and get involved in something. And so, I was going to do medical sales and helping women in medical sales and it never felt right. So about five months ago, I was like, you know what, that's not my calling. My calling is I need to help these moms, and I have to help these parents that are just starting this journey and they really don't know where to go for the resources that are out there. Months ago was when I started, and it's been so fun for me. It's given me this life.

Again, like I love helping people. So, this has been so amazing. I love it.

[00:10:31] Sanjay Parekh: So, you're running this now, obviously as a side hustle, right? You've still got your day job. What's the thing? Are you, obviously it's not just for parents of TBR1, because you already know all 190. You don't know the ones that haven't been diagnosed yet, but the 190.

So, is it open to all kinds? Is it just genetic? Is it like, what are your parameters for what you want to build here?

[00:10:57] Michelle Choairy: So, the reason I called it complex kids, Collective Wisdom4ComplexKids, because I did not want to differentiate. If you have a complex kid, you know you have a complex kid. So that is what I wanted to go with.

It's anybody who needs that help, you're struggling with your child, ADHD or autism or anything. Do you need that support? Do you need to know where to start? That's what I'm here for.

[00:11:35] Sanjay Parekh: Yeah. And that is, as a parent, whenever you get something like this, with your child or whoever in your life, it's always a struggle.

Like, where do you start? Because the first thing I think most of us naturally do is go online and start searching, but there's just so much. And it's hard to figure out what's the actual starting point. And then there's so much garbage there as well. So how have you thought about that for the business?

There's so many different things that could be wrong with a kid. And are you thinking about this? Like, okay, I want to make like little mini groups where we bucket everybody based on what their kid has. Or like, how are you thinking about this?

[00:12:18] Michelle Choairy: So, no matter what diagnosis you have, and even if you don't have a diagnosis, you are going to give the resources for your child to get better. So, one of the things that I teach is the very first thing is that you need to create a team around you. So, you need by that, I mean a medical team. The first thing that we go through is a list of symptoms. What is your child? What does your child have? Do you have a diagnosis? Do you not have a diagnosis?

If you don't have a diagnosis, what are the issues that you're seeing? What is bothering you? What has your mama got or your daddy got, telling you that there's something here? What are those things? And we go through it. And then we figure out, okay, so he's not talking yet. So, we need to figure out speech therapy, or, he's having behaviors.

So, we need to find some kind of behavioral therapy. He has ADHD, he won't stop, then we need to find the developmental pediatrician. So those, once we go through that list, we figure it out and we can address, I am not differentiating. All parents need the same kind of community and the same kind of support.

So, it's individualized. It really is.

[00:13:57] Sanjay Parekh: Yeah. Yeah. So when you were, it's only been a few months now, five months when you were starting this. Was there anything that made you nervous about doing this and, how did you overcome that? I see you smiling, so I'm assuming the answer is yes.

[00:14:12] Michelle Choairy: Yes. Yes. Do you know how hard it is to put yourself out in social media?

That was the scariest part of this whole thing. To know that this is what I was going to have to do to be able to get this. So, for the longest time, I kept postponing doing like a little video to put on social media or put pictures or tell stories about what's happening. I would just push it off and I could not do it.

And then one day I was like, I just have to do it, and it has to happen. And so, I actually did it. So that's what it was. So now I'm on social media. I have groups. I have people asking me questions. So, that is very different, and it's been fun.

[00:15:11] Sanjay Parekh: Okay. Michelle, be honest with me here. When you posted that video, did you break out into a cold sweat?

[00:15:19] Michelle Choairy: Well, let me just tell you that I had to re-record that video about five or six times. So, for me to put that on there.

[00:15:29] Sanjay Parekh: That's the beauty of being able to record and edit after the fact, right? That's why you don't think do things live because, there's the magic there of being able to do it.

[00:15:40] Michelle Choairy: Shaking, the shaking, sweating, you're like, oh, and then, after five times you lose that.

[00:15:49] Sanjay Parekh: Yeah. But I think a lot of times too, people appreciate it when they see that as well. So, it's okay if you're shaking and nervous because it is a little nerve wracking.

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[00:16:23] Sanjay Parekh: Let's talk about the organization a little bit. So, you've launched it. What do you have in terms of medium-and long-term goals for this now? Like, where do you see it in a few years, five years, ten years, let's say?

[00:16:35] Michelle Choairy: Okay. So my picture is so big that I don't even know if I should say it, but I really want this to be a hub, a place where the parents can come and they will find speech therapists and occupational therapists, and they will have that support, not just my support that would be there also, but other resources, other people in the group, doing retreats, bringing moms and parents in so they can get away for a day or two and enjoy themselves and take care of themselves. There's so much I could keep going on and on, but really that is how big I want this to be.

I want the moms and the dads and even the siblings to be able to come and enjoy the time and learn about how to deal with, take care of with your complex kid.

[00:17:45] Sanjay Parekh: So, in terms of this, I know you've only been doing it for a little while. Do you have any plans on how you make money or are you making any money?

Like what's the thought process there?

[00:17:57] Michelle Choairy: No money as of right now, but I'm working on that. So, what I want to do, there's two routes that I'm taking. One is I do want to do coaching. A group coaching, bringing people in, building that community for where they can ask questions, resources, and I can be that resource.

So, there's that part. And I also want to get out there and speak, bring awareness to what is happening with TBR1 and genetic disorders, what is happening with state funded programs, and how you can find those resources, or even in the school districts, I want to be out there helping large amounts of moms and dads.

And so speaking and coaching, that is where I'm seeing this. This is where I see it going in the next few months.

[00:18:57] Sanjay Parekh: Yeah. Yeah. Great. Okay. Let's switch gears a little bit and talk about, how do you balance all of these things? Because not only do you have a full time job, not only do you have now this new side hustle, which you're passionate about and helping, but you also have a kid, which was the one that spawned all of this stuff.

So how do you think about balancing all of these things and the time that you have between all of these things?

[00:19:25] Michelle Choairy: I have two kids. So just want to point that out, so it's not just one. So, one of the things about being in this business that I've been in orthopedic sales is that I was able in the 17 years to build a team around me.

I will tell you that without that team, I wouldn't be able to do probably half of the things that I do. So, I rely on them. I really appreciate what they do. We help each other out. And so, I've been able to take these little times throughout the day, like I'm doing right now. And then I'm going to go back to work after this, put my scrubs back on and go back to the operating room.

Really, in everything in your life, and this is what I try to tell my moms and dads is that unless you have a community, it takes a village. So, it takes a village for me to be able to do this. It takes a village to be able to help my son. It takes a village to be able to work. Unless you build that community around you, you're not going to be able to do it. So that is how I balance. That is how I balance this life of mine.

[00:20:40] Sanjay Parekh: Yeah. Yeah. What about boundaries then, for you? So, you've got balance maybe because you've got these communities, these teams. What about setting boundaries between these things? Because your side hustle is also your life.

Because you're dealing with these things and there's a lot of times where you've probably got things in life that then you're like, oh, this could help me in the side hustle. And these things can blend and bleed over very easily. So how do you think about boundaries for yourself?

[00:21:14] Michelle Choairy: So, it was very hard for me to be able to set boundaries, especially at work because at work, it's so hard.

We're on call. If somebody breaks their ankle, we have to go in and we have to take care of it. So, I am on call. But because of the support and because of the team, we are not on call as much. So, there's six of us. We take turns. And so, it's not overwhelming, but I had to do that.

I had to make sure that it wasn't just me taking the call. It wasn't just me, the one, the old timer here doing, being in all these surgeries. So, I had to teach people to be like me and be able to do it. So that is how I did it. And so, when I am off work, I'm off work and I'm with my son and I'm with my daughter, the weekends, if I'm not on call, my phone is in the corner.

I'm not taking calls. If it's something that can wait until Monday, we'll wait until Monday. Now, you do have the other way around that leads through a little bit, right? You have the, all of the therapy appointments, babysitters, school, and all of that. And so that leads in and sometimes you just have to, you have to take it when it's your kid.

And but I think that the biggest thing for me in all the years I've been doing this is that the work was the hardest thing to set boundaries at on. So that's what I've done. I hope that makes sense.

[00:22:56] Sanjay Parekh: Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Has there been anything that's in doing this that has really surprised you?

Like you recognize the need, because you had the need as a parent and we're probably groping around in the dark trying to figure out what to do next. But has there been anything that surprised you by now interacting with all of these other parents?

[00:23:20] Michelle Choairy: The amount of misinformation and people not knowing.

There are so many programs, so many things that people can get through the school district through the different resources. And they just don't know, they don't know where to go. Like they don't even know that it exists a lot of times. So that is surprising to me.

[00:23:47] Sanjay Parekh: Where do you think that failure is happening?

Because some of these programs that you're talking about are obviously taxpayer funded. So, we're all paying for it. It should be known, but it's not known. You're right. there's plenty of programs I know that exist that I don't know about that could probably help. So where do you see this as a failure?

[00:24:09] Michelle Choairy: The failure starts when everybody's telling you that your child's going to outgrow. That is the first thing that happens.

[00:24:18] Sanjay Parekh: So, you don't even go looking for resources because of that?

[00:24:22] Michelle Choairy: Yes. So, you go to your pediatrician who has no idea. And they say, oh, just wait, and then you just keep waiting. You just keep waiting.

And then you miss the opportunity of early start programs and getting in, getting them into the under three years old programs. And so, it's awareness. It really is bringing awareness to the parents. Hey, you have that gut feeling. Follow that. Follow it. If it's nothing, then it's nothing and it's great.

But if it is something you're starting early. So, I'm trying to do a lot of things with the physicians and also with the pediatricians. Hey, if people are coming in here and asking you help them, let's give them resources and not just a little flyer here, let's give them like really, because that's what I got. I got a flyer. Oh, here you go. You can go and you can look this up online or you can call them. But okay. But it's going to go on my pile.

[00:25:41] Sanjay Parekh: Yeah. And even if you look at it, sometimes it's hard to understand what it is that you're looking at because we're not medical professionals always, right?

And even sometimes medical professionals, dealing with this as parents may not really fully understand what it is they've got on their hands.

[00:25:56] Michelle Choairy: So, I have to tell you just a quick story. Actually, my pediatrician now, she emails me for resources. Because I have been in the search for these things that she emails me and she goes, hey, I need a good speech therapist.

There's a kid that got diagnosed with childhood apraxia of speech. Where would you send them? And so, at least she has me. What about the other pediatricians out there?

[00:26:28] Sanjay Parekh: What about the other tens of thousands of pediatricians across the country? And across the world, let alone just here in the US. Yeah, I think what you're pointing to is a huge challenge.

And the other thing you're pointing to is, the fact that these interventions are being delayed has a societal impact because there's a lesser chance that we're able to deal with them successfully because we're delaying that intervention. And then obviously the impact to the parents and the family and everything else.

It's a hard thing. And I think your advice there to anybody that's listening to that is apparent. If you think something is wrong, if you think there's your child needs something then make sure you continue to advocate for them and don't give up based on what somebody says. And especially if they just say they'll outgrow it because maybe they will and hopefully they will but maybe they won't and you need to deal with it.

Last kind of a couple of questions here for you. What advice would you give to other parents who are thinking about starting their own initiatives or organizations to support a cause they care about, especially as it relates to their children?

[00:27:43] Michelle Choairy: Just do it, go do it. I heard probably about a month ago, I heard this really interesting thing.

If you have that pull into doing something, it's probably all the voices of the people that need you calling out to you. So just do it. They need you. They're going to find you.

[00:28:11] Sanjay Parekh: Okay. Very last question for you, Michelle. If you could go back in time and do something differently, what is that? What would you do?

I know it's only been five months, but so five months back in time, maybe.

[00:28:28] Michelle Choairy: I probably would have not hired a brand. How do I say, I wouldn't have signed a contract. I would have tried to find somebody who can help me one-on-one. I think that's because I lost a lot of time doing some of the stuff that I was doing.

So, I think that finding a one-on-one coach to help you through this. And also get a VA or somebody who knows computers right away, because if you don't know computers and you don't know social media, you're out of luck. So that's what I would do differently. I would probably have looked for different resources than the way that I did it.

[00:29:18] Sanjay Parekh: Yeah. Yeah, absolutely.

Michelle, this has been fantastic. Where can our listeners find and connect with you online?

[00:29:24] Michelle Choairy: So, they can find me on Facebook. It's Wisdom4ComplexKids. And then also on Instagram and on my website, which is also the same thing. Wisdom4ComplexKids.

[00:29:42] Sanjay Parekh: Excellent. Thanks so much for being on today.

[00:29:44] Michelle Choairy: Oh, thank you for having me.

[00:29:50] Sanjay Parekh: Thanks for listening to this week's episode of the Side Hustle to Small Business podcast, powered by Hiscox. To learn more about how Hiscox can help protect your small business through intelligent insurance solutions, visit Hiscox.com. And to hear more Side Hustle to Small Business stories, or share your own story, please visit Hiscox.com/side-hustle-to-small-business. I'm your host, Sanjay Parekh. You can find out more about me at my website, SanjayParekh.com.